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October 18, 2018, 20:45:22 pm


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Author Topic: Actually, No problems Just a MOP question to learn something.  (Read 539 times)
huntleybill
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« on: July 15, 2018, 02:52:35 am »

So I was going to mill out this clock. The plan is to mill out the face of a clock 1/8" down. Mill out the whole face except for the numbers. So, I selected each number to highlight all of them, then also selected the perimeter and converted it to a region.

My question  is, when I choose the MOP, should I do a pocket or a 3dprofile? Is one better over the other? Is one more correct than the other. The only thing I noticed is when I go to create a tool path, the pocket takes FOREVER! the 3dprofile takes a few seconds.

Just curious to learn why something works.
Thank you for your advice.
Bill

* WallClock-TinyDottie.cb (81.03 KB - downloaded 22 times.)
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Bob La Londe
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« Reply #1 on: July 15, 2018, 03:14:38 am »

You use 1/8 inch as a reference so I assumed you were working in inches... until I saw your clock was 225 inches across. 

At 225 inches across its going to take a looooooong time even to just profile.


I so no 3D object or 3D operations in your CB file. 

I see pockets and profiles.  Pockets will take longer since hey have to clear all the material and do more work.  Take longer to generate code too.  More work to generate more tool paths.  Second pocket should have surface set to match tarrget depth of 1st pocket so it isn't cutting air.  Would reduce code generation time too. 





 
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huntleybill
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« Reply #2 on: July 15, 2018, 04:07:28 am »

I thought CB always measured in mm. Even if you have inches chosen in units. Am I wrong? No wonder it is taking so long!

I set it up as pockets but then started thinking if I should do this in 3Dprofile, so I was asking.

So Bob are you saying the only difference in using pockets over 3D is the generation time?
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dave benson
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« Reply #3 on: July 15, 2018, 08:10:43 am »

Hi Bill
I see you are pretty keen on doing stuff like this, so lets start at the beginning.
 
When starting  any serious or not so serious  CB  project, its nice to start from a template.
What is a template? Well it's a CB  file that has some properties pre-configured among other things (for instance the stock dimensions) so when starting a new CB file you can choose New From Template and your CB file will be ready to go set up just the way you like it.

In the picture you can see that I resized the picture and set the stock size (orange) and added a layer called Machine Limits.(blue) you would set these values to suit your particular machine.

If you open a new CB file and then do these two things and save the file in the templates folder
then you can choose from the file menu new from template and then click on the template file you just made.

Setting the stock dimensions helps later on if you want to use the simulator or just as visual aide when laying out work.

The machine Limits can help with laying out work. For instance when importing a drawing you can see if the geometry fits you machines work envelope and might need to be resized or just setting your stock orientation for clamping ect.

One you have your template and have opened it up, then import your drawing (clock geometry) file
I'm assuming it's a .dxf and then select all and resize it from mm to inches.

You should now have have something like the pic.

You can then region the geometry and apply a Pocket mop with an 1/8 end mill
make two more copies of the mop and change one to 1\4 and the other to 3\8.

generate the tool paths and selectively turn on the mops one at a time, small end mills give you more detail in your cuts but take for ever, large end mills are a lot faster removing material but give give a lot less detail.

You would normally use a roughing and a finishing mop for your pocket for this reason.

Get your cb file to this point and post a screen shot so that I can see every-things ok and we'll talk about pockets.

Dave

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dwc
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« Reply #4 on: July 15, 2018, 09:40:45 am »

I thought CB always measured in mm.

Hi Bill,
Actually, CB doesn't care what the units are. It works in units, it is the controller of your mill that converts those units to mm, inches or light years.
You set metric or imperial units so CB puts the correct command in the g-code to tell the controller how to interprete the units.
Have fun,
Don
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Bob La Londe
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« Reply #5 on: July 15, 2018, 14:14:12 pm »

Nothing in your file is really 3D. 

You have 2.5D operations being performed on 2D objects. 


If have units set to inches you need to work in inches.  If you have units set to mm you have to work in mm.  Otherwise you cut 25.4 times to big or 25.4 times to small. 
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huntleybill
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« Reply #6 on: July 15, 2018, 16:09:55 pm »

  If have units set to inches you need to work in inches.  If you have units set to mm you have to work in mm.  Otherwise you cut 25.4 times to big or 25.4 times to small. 

When I set "units" to mm and measure across the face of the clock, I get 225. When I set the "units" to inches and I measure across the clock face, I get 225 and so forth . So I assume by this even tho I have "units" set to inches, when I measure the face, the resulting measurement is in mm. I have no idea why that is  because all other settings change over to the "units" that are chosen. This is also confusing when I go to "resize" something. Am I in mm or inches? SO would I choose (is the resizing window) mm to inches, or inches to mm? Remember, no matter what units I'm in, that clock face measures 225 BTW the clock face should be 8 7/8 inches (225 mm)
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huntleybill
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« Reply #7 on: July 15, 2018, 16:26:28 pm »

Dave:
I'm going to try out your suggestions about using templates but this clock (for example) is a one time thing so to setup a template of stock size etc. seems a waste of time because I would only use that template once. Or am I missing your point?
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Bob La Londe
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« Reply #8 on: July 15, 2018, 17:05:56 pm »

Quote
Remember, no matter what units I'm in, that clock face measures 225 BTW the clock face should be 8 7/8 inches (225 mm)

No.  No matter what units you are working in that clock measures 225 units. 

If the units says inches and the clock seems to big try this. 

Ctrl A
Right Click
> Transform
>> Resize
>>>  [mm to inches]
>>>>  [Apply]

When I opened your file I instantly knew it was a scale issue because the entire grid (20x20) I work with (I work in inches) was a small grey blob in the middle. 


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Getting started on CNC?  In or passing through my area?
If I have the time I'll be glad to show you a little in my shop. 

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EddyCurrent
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« Reply #9 on: July 15, 2018, 20:54:53 pm »

Only use 3D MOps when 2D MOps can't do it, also you need a 'surface' in order to use 3D MOps

Modified cb file attached.

1. open cb file Bill attached to first post
2. select all geometry then, Edit->Transform->Resize->mm to inches ( as Bob's post suggested )
3. using 1/8" tool, pocket inner parts of numbers
4. using 1/4" tool,pocket outside of numbers area
5. using 1/8" tool, profile outside of numbers area to remove material left by 1/4" tool
6. cut clock face out (using Bill's original Profile MOP)

You will notice from the picture that a 1/8" tool is too large to fit into some of the small spaces.

Edit: I forgot about the hole in the middle  Roll Eyes that's one for you to add Bill

The CamBam manual is a great read, it helps a lot in understanding and using the software.

* WallClock-TinyDottie_B.cb (81.63 KB - downloaded 12 times.)

* clock.jpg (114.14 KB, 800x769 - viewed 20 times.)
« Last Edit: July 15, 2018, 21:06:32 pm by EddyCurrent » Logged
huntleybill
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« Reply #10 on: July 15, 2018, 22:20:54 pm »

Thank you Eddy

Actually, this post started out asking basically the differences in 3Dprofile and pockets. Then kind of morphed in this but I am NOT complaining as this is my first real attempt with pocket MOP's and I am learning some good stuff here!

Thank you ALL!
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dwc
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« Reply #11 on: July 16, 2018, 07:44:51 am »

When I set "units" to mm and measure across the face of the clock, I get 225. When I set the "units" to inches and I measure across the clock face, I get 225 and so forth .
It is like I said above.  CB doesn't use the inch/mm info except to send it to your controller.
When you change the "units" the values don't change, just how they are interpreted on your controller.
If you want to change the values use >edit>transform>resize
There you have the complete transformation matrix to play with. 
For simple inch->mm or mm->inch resizing there are preset buttons at the lower left of the window.
Don
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Bubba
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« Reply #12 on: July 16, 2018, 19:02:05 pm »

When I set "units" to mm and measure across the face of the clock, I get 225. When I set the "units" to inches and I measure across the clock face, I get 225 and so forth .
*************************

Yes, those are units that the clock face is. By using transform, resize you can change its size to either mm or an inch.
I attached screen shot showing resize options..


* Capture.JPG (85.88 KB, 978x630 - viewed 26 times.)
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